Leaking fuel between ip and timing case

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Leaking fuel between ip and timing case

Postby liftarc » Tue Aug 02, 2016 5:52 pm

92 D350 auto 205k miles

So my trucks mileage has gone to $hit in the last few weeks and in the last few days Ive noticed a smell of fuel when exiting the truck. I searched briefly and found mention of a rotor o ring that may cause this, idk if thats really it.

Im working 7 days a week right now between 2 jobsites 4 and 6 hours from home.

Is this something I can fix after work one night in a few hours or should I see about getting a tow?

I have basic hand tools, not a lot I'm a welder not a mechanic.

Does the whole front of the engine need to be tore down to fix this?

Edit:

Sorry, the details.... Leaking between ip and timing case, I can see the fuel come out when I goose the throttle. Theres fuel all over but its coming out slowly when I look, just a trickle. I see it at the ip mounting bolt directly above the centerline of the vac pump.
92 D350 club cab flatbed dually-201k G360, NP205,D60 swap soon
92 Ramcharger 5.9 Magnum, 46rh, NP241-238k
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Re: Leaking fuel between ip and timing case

Postby liftarc » Tue Aug 02, 2016 6:12 pm

So my oil is seriously diluted with fuel, fuel all over the engine. Looks like Im stranded in St Helena - yuppie hell with not so much as a damn parts store.....
92 D350 club cab flatbed dually-201k G360, NP205,D60 swap soon
92 Ramcharger 5.9 Magnum, 46rh, NP241-238k
liftarc
fuel screw!!!!
 
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Location: State of Jefferson

Re: Leaking fuel between ip and timing case

Postby DodgeFreak » Tue Aug 02, 2016 6:23 pm

You would have to pull the pump to replace the seal. Its not a hard job but takes a little while to pull it.
92 D350 Cab and Chassis. Auto stock, wiring gremlins. 330k miles
92 W250 Ext cab rotted completely out. Auto, pump maxed, 215 ppump nozzles, Denny T2 pin.
85 D350 single wheel, converted to cummins, getrag, turned up 2 turns and afc screw flush.
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Re: Leaking fuel between ip and timing case

Postby liftarc » Tue Aug 02, 2016 7:29 pm

Can it be done without special tools? What size is the o ring?
92 D350 club cab flatbed dually-201k G360, NP205,D60 swap soon
92 Ramcharger 5.9 Magnum, 46rh, NP241-238k
liftarc
fuel screw!!!!
 
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Re: Leaking fuel between ip and timing case

Postby DodgeFreak » Tue Aug 02, 2016 8:00 pm

Its not an oring its a seal. You will need a puller to pull the gear of the pump, you will need metric tools. I done one a few years ago but can't remember what all tools you will need. The curved wrench is a bonus but I think you can get the bolts off with 1\4 drive stuff and swivel.
92 D350 Cab and Chassis. Auto stock, wiring gremlins. 330k miles
92 W250 Ext cab rotted completely out. Auto, pump maxed, 215 ppump nozzles, Denny T2 pin.
85 D350 single wheel, converted to cummins, getrag, turned up 2 turns and afc screw flush.
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Re: Leaking fuel between ip and timing case

Postby liftarc » Tue Aug 02, 2016 8:22 pm

Ok so I need to figure out what to buy to reseal it. I have metric tools in the truck and a welder and ginder at work to make a curved wrench and gear puller. Think Ill see if I can get the part locally and fix it in the winery parking lot before Friday. Have to be in Fresno Sat am.....
92 D350 club cab flatbed dually-201k G360, NP205,D60 swap soon
92 Ramcharger 5.9 Magnum, 46rh, NP241-238k
liftarc
fuel screw!!!!
 
Posts: 96
Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2016 1:28 pm
Location: State of Jefferson
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Re: Leaking fuel between ip and timing case

Postby liftarc » Tue Aug 02, 2016 8:25 pm

https://www.ecstuning.com/b-bosch-parts ... oCni3w_wcB

Does this kit have the seal and if so which piece is it?

Edit: Ok this is the kit I need -

https://puredieselpower.com/dodge-produ ... duct/19349

Thank you, DodgeFreak
92 D350 club cab flatbed dually-201k G360, NP205,D60 swap soon
92 Ramcharger 5.9 Magnum, 46rh, NP241-238k
liftarc
fuel screw!!!!
 
Posts: 96
Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2016 1:28 pm
Location: State of Jefferson
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Re: Leaking fuel between ip and timing case

Postby 1320Fastback » Tue Aug 02, 2016 8:49 pm

Sorry to cross post but guy need help ;)


This write up is what your going to need to do.
http://www.cumminsforum.com/forum/89-93 ... -seal.html

Get the seal at a Bosch dealer/ bosch pump rebuilder.


The 13mm curved wrench comes in VERY handy for removing the pump.

Do not drop the nut, washer or shaft key inside the cover or your taking your timing cover off next and maybe oil pan.
92 D250, Getrag 5 Speed, 3.54, extra cab, long bed, AC works, Airbags.
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Re: Leaking fuel between ip and timing case

Postby 1320Fastback » Tue Aug 02, 2016 8:50 pm

liftarc wrote:https://www.ecstuning.com/b-bosch-parts/injection-pump-seal-kit/2467010003-000~b/?gclid=CjwKEAjwiYG9BRCkgK-G45S323oSJABnykKA-_lZpAsYWIztyO__7Dwa6Ej3JD5QDMcaIWZfgpaWfxoCni3w_wcB

Does this kit have the seal and if so which piece is it?

Edit: Ok this is the kit I need -

https://puredieselpower.com/dodge-produ ... duct/19349

Thank you, DodgeFreak


Yes the second kit,the seal in the middle of that big triangle gasket is the one that blew out and is polluting your oil.
92 D250, Getrag 5 Speed, 3.54, extra cab, long bed, AC works, Airbags.
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fuel pin?
 
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Re: Leaking fuel between ip and timing case

Postby 1320Fastback » Tue Aug 02, 2016 8:56 pm

Take a awl and scribe the side of the pump at one of the nuts where it meets the timing cover so you can get it back in the exact same position/Timing.

Also might want to look into fuel return hose restriction. These shaft seals don't normally pop out, it does happen sometimes but if your return line is kinked or blocked somehow excess bleed pressure from the injectors will have no where to go but into the pump. This would and did cause my seal to blow out earlier this year. I had inadvertently bent the plastic return line while changing the starter.
92 D250, Getrag 5 Speed, 3.54, extra cab, long bed, AC works, Airbags.
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Re: Leaking fuel between ip and timing case

Postby liftarc » Tue Aug 02, 2016 9:28 pm

1320Fastback wrote:Sorry to cross post but guy need help ;)


This write up is what your going to need to do.
http://www.cumminsforum.com/forum/89-93 ... -seal.html

Get the seal at a Bosch dealer/ bosch pump rebuilder.


The 13mm curved wrench comes in VERY handy for removing the pump.

Do not drop the nut, washer or shaft key inside the cover or your taking your timing cover off next and maybe oil pan.


Thank you for the link and I will check the return line also. I dont think the shaft seal blew out, probably dried out from sitting long term before I bought the truck. I got it earlier this year and have been driving it to work all over the state since.
92 D350 club cab flatbed dually-201k G360, NP205,D60 swap soon
92 Ramcharger 5.9 Magnum, 46rh, NP241-238k
liftarc
fuel screw!!!!
 
Posts: 96
Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2016 1:28 pm
Location: State of Jefferson
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Re: Leaking fuel between ip and timing case

Postby liftarc » Wed Aug 03, 2016 10:37 am

Ive got shaft seal part no 2 460 283 001, mounting gasket and banjo washers from Santa Rosa Diesel.

The guy there asked if I was planning to replace the seal with the pump on the engine or if I was pulling the pump. I got the stuff to pull the pump and now Im wondering....

Can I replace the seal without pulling the pump and which way is easier?
92 D350 club cab flatbed dually-201k G360, NP205,D60 swap soon
92 Ramcharger 5.9 Magnum, 46rh, NP241-238k
liftarc
fuel screw!!!!
 
Posts: 96
Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2016 1:28 pm
Location: State of Jefferson
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Re: Leaking fuel between ip and timing case

Postby DodgeFreak » Wed Aug 03, 2016 1:06 pm

only way i could see you replacing the seal with the pump on the engine is to pull the front cover which then you would need the crank seal and coolant. If you could do it with the pump on the engine and pull the front cover you could at least then tab the dowl pin. and tighten the other case bolts. I'm not sure though and would want to hear from someone that has more experience than I.
92 D350 Cab and Chassis. Auto stock, wiring gremlins. 330k miles
92 W250 Ext cab rotted completely out. Auto, pump maxed, 215 ppump nozzles, Denny T2 pin.
85 D350 single wheel, converted to cummins, getrag, turned up 2 turns and afc screw flush.
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14mm rotor
 
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Re: Leaking fuel between ip and timing case

Postby 1320Fastback » Wed Aug 03, 2016 6:55 pm

I just did KDP, case bolts, removed and resealed the entire pump so here's my $0.02

The seal is behind the drive gear which you can not move with the timing cover on like DodgeFreak says. To replace seal with pump ON motor you would have to pull the radiator, fan, hoses, belt, remove crank dampener, remove timing cover, remove nut and washer from pump and then pull the gear off. Only then could you press a new seal into the pump.

Your correct though if the KDP hadn't been done or you just don't know, if you have the time this would be the way to fix it. All of my case bolts were finger tight at best when I did mine a few months ago but the KDP hadn't moved at all.

So if you don't have time to tab the KDP and loctite the bolts right now pulling the pump is a lot less work. Remove oil fill tube, remove nut and washer behind it, scribe an alignment mark where pump meets case and remove the 3-13mm pump mount bolts, pop the gear loose of the pump shaft with a puller, remove throttle cable and the three electric wires, remove the 6 injection tubes and their clamps up at valve covers, there is a nut and a bracket under the pump to loosen and swing out of the way and then the pump should come out.

It sounds like a lot but is much easier than taking the timing cover off, it's just lots of little things.
92 D250, Getrag 5 Speed, 3.54, extra cab, long bed, AC works, Airbags.
1320Fastback
fuel pin?
 
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Re: Leaking fuel between ip and timing case

Postby liftarc » Wed Aug 03, 2016 8:44 pm

Seems like if the opening in the timing case is large enough to access the seal then it should be doable but idk.

I put about an hour and a half into pulling the pump after work, mostly disconnected except supply line fitting is siezed and just wants to strip.

Glad I chose to pull the pump off, rear bracket was floppy loose, one bolt missing. The two easy to reach nuts holding the pump on the studs were little more than hand tight.

I couldnt get the engine turned, belt slips and I have no barring tool, hoping to get the tool tomorrow
92 D350 club cab flatbed dually-201k G360, NP205,D60 swap soon
92 Ramcharger 5.9 Magnum, 46rh, NP241-238k
liftarc
fuel screw!!!!
 
Posts: 96
Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2016 1:28 pm
Location: State of Jefferson
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