Turbo suggestions.

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Turbo suggestions.

Postby jethro » Fri Feb 15, 2019 10:02 pm

Running a STOCK 93 12 valve in an f-350. Has the turbo that was on engine-- (I think it was called an HF-6 ????) I had the core re-ringed but it still seems to be slobbering oil into the hot side which makes a constant stink. In use the pressure doesnt really come up untill about half way up the RPM range. Kind of dead below there. I guess I will have to take it off if I want to stop the oil leak.
Im thinking I could change the exhaust housing to a 16 from the bigger one that it probably has.
OR--- I could just get an HX-35 which I understand was the stock unit on the later engines that had the In-Line fuel inj. pump. Is the 35 the same external dimensions as the one I have ?
(so I dont have to cut my header pipes)
Would the 2 ways to go be the same in performance ? (assuming I can get the hf-6 to stop leaking oil)
Looks like the oil is being slung off the edge of the compressor wheel and making its way to the outside of the unit. seems like the rings must be leaking- or an O-ring ?

Like to get more pressure at lower RPM. I am only getting about 6 or 7 psi in normal flatland traffic (trying to drive normaly for good MPG) I have just installed a gear vendors OD so I would like more boost in the lower 1/3 rpm.
Also _ I am using the ford intercooler -- which looks like it could be double the size of the dodge unit-- which could represent quite a bit of volume to pressurize when trying to build the pressure.


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Re: Turbo suggestions.

Postby PToombs » Sat Feb 16, 2019 9:59 am

Tim, stock turbo is an H1C, or WH1C, almost the same thing. It probably has the 21cm exhaust housing on it. You can change it to a 16cm, or a 12cm like the H35 has. Or you can throw an HX 35 on since your cartridge appears to still be leaking after being resealed. An HX 35 should bolt right on, you may have to do some reclocking of the housings to get things to line up but that's not a big deal.
A smaller exhaust housing will help it to spool better for sure, and that bigger IC is contributing to the lag.
For what you are doing the HX 35 should be a good replacement.
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Re: Turbo suggestions.

Postby jethro » Tue Feb 19, 2019 10:56 am

YES--- H1C -- thats the number -- couldnt remember.
I had to re-clock this one too since I am running it out of factory position.

Maybe my local place can bench test it to see why the leak is happening. They did the re-ring
on it----

The 16 cm housing is fairly cheap if I can get the existing core to seal properly.
After I put the gear vendors overdrive on it--- I can do the expressway in double over and do
60 at a fast idle. (next little job is to mount the trigger wheel for the tach...:-) )
So a little pressure at lower RPM would be convenient.

Might also replace it with a good used hx-35 if I can find one---

Only getting about 3 psi at lower RPM and about 6-7 just before shift RPM. I can feel a little
"kick" and hear the turbo RPM come up...... but precious little at lower RPM--- like the first
half of the run-up on each gear......

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Re: Turbo suggestions.

Postby Remps » Tue Feb 19, 2019 6:08 pm

Another turbo that might work for you, and might be available dirt cheap, would be an hy35. Spool even faster than a hx35, but tend to choke off above 30ish psi, whereas the hx is ok up to about 35 psi. Less popular than the hx, so potential cheapness is there. A 93 h1c should have a 18.5 housing on it, so going to a 16 won't make much difference, I wouldn't go that route.
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'90 W250 R/C,47rh,K@N,HX35,1/8" bump,2nd gen IC,boost,egt,trans temp.3.07's.
'96 2500 S/C L/B,2wd,NV5600,3.54 L/S,cai,egt,pacbrake,mbrp exhaust,10 plate.
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Re: Turbo suggestions.

Postby Donkey Kong » Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:17 pm

I have a HX35 on my 93 and have been very pleased.
Darth Cummins 93 CC W250 NV4500 HX35 350hp 37s 1.5T leafs...its stiff
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Re: Turbo suggestions.

Postby jethro » Fri Feb 22, 2019 12:31 am

where would be a likely place to shop for a used HY-35 or hx-35 ? Craigslist maybe ?
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Re: Turbo suggestions.

Postby PToombs » Sat Feb 23, 2019 7:09 pm

Craigslist, e-bay, facebook marketplace. If you are buying used it's nice to be able to put your hands on it to check end play on the shaft and stuff.
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Re: Turbo suggestions.

Postby DMan1198 » Sat Feb 23, 2019 7:19 pm

You always like to play with the shaft don’t you Pete?
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Re: Turbo suggestions.

Postby PToombs » Sun Feb 24, 2019 9:16 am

That's just wrong Ducati!

Besides, it's my shaft and I'll play with it all I want! :mrgreen:
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Re: Turbo suggestions.

Postby spencerdiesel » Sun Feb 24, 2019 12:41 pm

A good used HX35 would be a solid candidate like many stated previous.

I hope this doesn’t come off the wrong way but if mpg is a big goal I probably wouldn’t go with an hy35. In a light load cruise situation most turbo’d diesels are running with a huge surplus of air; more than needed to burn the small amount of fuel. Once past a certain amount of boost (varies for every setup, but my laggy 21 I had burned all available fuel in LIGHTLY loaded/ steady cruise scenarios), more boost contributes to more pumping loss. Peak efficiency/ mpg is had when the minimum amount of air required to completely burn all fuel is used.

The few 12V’s I’ve driven with HX35’s and stock timing were able to have a decent amount of boost by 1200 or so rpm. My buddy did have an HY on this 93 and it would light almost off idle; but it was choked and falling on its face by about 2500 rpm, and the added back pressure from an HY increases cyl. pressure.
1992 W250, 5 speed, 4.10, Ext. cab Ext. bed, 12.5k winch, 75 gal. fuel tank

H1C/18

Fuel: THD 6x10 VCO sticks, THD 12 psi piston pump, THD fuel pin, 366 spring, fuel screw 2 turns in, timing to the head/ >1/4”
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Re: Turbo suggestions.

Postby Remps » Sun Feb 24, 2019 7:14 pm

Yea, I wouldn't go with a hy either if max mpg was the goal, I find the hx is too restrictive for getting great mileage as well, never been over 24 mpg with the hx, p-pump or ve. The hx works decent with my 3.07's and 47rh, plenty of boost response at low rpms in OD. But lowest rpms doesn't equal max efficiency. But pretty darn efficient with a good tailwind, extreme weight loss and drastic aerodynamic treatments would make this low of cruise rpm relevant to efficiency. But 3rd gear on the highway, the old 12 valve would be way happier with an 18.5 housing on the hx. I've been over 27 mpg with both 50 and 54 mm h1c's with 18.5 housings, in a 90 2wd 3spd, and a 93 2wd 5spd. I also had no problem making 30 psi by 1500 rpm with an 18.5 h1c and 5x18 sticks, timed to the head, they're not that laggy with a bit of fuel and a decently tuned pump. HX35 does almost feel like a supercharger in comparison to an 18.5 h1c though. I personally like the h1c better myself, I feel they make more hp per lb of boost compared to the hx. Maybe we should just trade turbos lol.
'90 D250 R/C,727,IC,6x.009's,1/8" bump,fuel psi,straight pipe w/5" stack.
'90 W250 R/C,47rh,K@N,HX35,1/8" bump,2nd gen IC,boost,egt,trans temp.3.07's.
'96 2500 S/C L/B,2wd,NV5600,3.54 L/S,cai,egt,pacbrake,mbrp exhaust,10 plate.
Bring back the Bank of Canada, PRE- 1974.
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Re: Turbo suggestions.

Postby jethro » Sun Feb 24, 2019 10:24 pm

Spencer and Remps---- Thanks--- I m asking because I WANT to hear the voices of "been there done that"...….
I understand your point about over-airing just causing more drag on engine and mpg loss. I drive this truck pretty conservatively.
With the gear vendors overdrive I now have 8 fwd. gears to go through from stoped to 75+. I can feel the pressure giving me a little
kick in about the upper 1/3 of the RPM range before time to shift. The middle 1/3 is OK but the lower 1/3 is a little slow to pick up.
Im thinking the H1C is probably kicking in when it is designed to--- it just seems like I would like 3 or 4 psi off the line instead of zero.
I guess that lower 1/3 is the engine just being non-turbo'd.

Also---- I THOUGHT I has a oil leak in the core of the turbo--- as I was seeing a little oil on the outside of the housing. Before I turned the smoke screw out a half turn a couple days ago--- I gunked and rinsed the turbo to try to spot the source of the leak. So I drove it about an hour --
and later looked at the turbo and its dry as a bone outside now. NOW-- Im starting to wonder if having the smoke screw in too far may have
been giving me a idle that was slobbering with unburnt fuel--- and that fuel going through the turbo was mixing with the soot in there and just
slinging off the blades and making its way out through the stepped "seals" which don't really seal. (where the housings meet the core)
I m thinking that wasn't oil I was seeing but a fuel-soot mix. SO--- if my core is OK and not leaking--- maybe I could just go to the next smaller housing. I assume I have an 18 on it--- and I see 16's are fairly cheep--- but whats up with the price on 14 inch housings????? Like 160$ vs
350$ ……. what am I missing there??????

I tend to agree -- maybe even the HX-35 might be more than I need airwise. I just want to perk up that lower 1/3 so I don't have to wait on it to kind of catch up. Soon I will fill up and test my fuel mileage. I hope it might be in the upper 20's -- but who knows.

Thanks for the ideas --- keep em coming if you have em ! I hope Richard Roundtree isn't reading this thread---- :-)
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Re: Turbo suggestions.

Postby Remps » Mon Feb 25, 2019 5:55 am

Gated vs non gated prices, gated costs more. And with the way you drive, I don't think a wastegate is necessary. I think non gated 14 cm housings are available, but don't quote me on that. And you can't increase fuel at idle without increasing the idle speed. Diesels are completely throttled by diesel. Any increase in fuel input directly raises rpms. Once the throttle moves however, the smoke screw determines the amount of fuel available pre-boost. And as was mentioned in another post, if your truck is running smoke free, it is likely lacking fuel, throttle not opening properly or something. With a little more fuel, provided you don't have a boost leak, you'd see better throttle response on the lower end of the rpms.
Last edited by Remps on Mon Feb 25, 2019 6:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
'90 D250 R/C,727,IC,6x.009's,1/8" bump,fuel psi,straight pipe w/5" stack.
'90 W250 R/C,47rh,K@N,HX35,1/8" bump,2nd gen IC,boost,egt,trans temp.3.07's.
'96 2500 S/C L/B,2wd,NV5600,3.54 L/S,cai,egt,pacbrake,mbrp exhaust,10 plate.
Bring back the Bank of Canada, PRE- 1974.
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Re: Turbo suggestions.

Postby spencerdiesel » Mon Feb 25, 2019 6:01 am

One upside to a hy or hx is theyre great for keeping coking at bay if you ever run waste oil :D
1992 W250, 5 speed, 4.10, Ext. cab Ext. bed, 12.5k winch, 75 gal. fuel tank

H1C/18

Fuel: THD 6x10 VCO sticks, THD 12 psi piston pump, THD fuel pin, 366 spring, fuel screw 2 turns in, timing to the head/ >1/4”
Muffler delete

Minimum 60% WMO full time since Sep. 2018
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Re: Turbo suggestions.

Postby jethro » Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:17 pm

Remps-- when I had the smoke screw in about 3/4 of a turn--- it wasnt accelerating quite as good as now---
but I was getting a little blurp of smoke as I was loading the engine shifting into 3-rd gear-- but none otherwise. Now I have slightly better acceleration but the between-gear smoke puff is gone now----
Before it felt like it was slightly choking on fuel at the lower RPM's. - kind of had to wait on it while the extra fuel either burned or got blown out..... kind of slowed the shift sequence.
I might try a 14 inch housing if I can find one for less than a Buggatti convertable...... :-)

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