ABS delete + RWAL delete =great brakes?

[monoblock]

I was alarmed to read the many posts about deleting the ABS to solve brake problems. Even the RWAL gets lots of criticism. I am all for deletion,simplification,low cost and great brakes but wondered if the ABS delete and RWAL remedies were necessary? My concern is that my truck will be used as a dump truck and will haul granite. So the physics and hydraulic issues involved in stopping without lock-up/pedal drop/spongy brakes/uneven braking whether unladen or fully laden is a challenge. It's a challenge that RWAL and ABS are supposed to solve ,not hinder.
Did the system work well when our trucks were new? Is the solution just an easily overlooked maintenance issue -like replacing flexible ,rubber brake lines and adjusting rear brakes(but they have automatic adjusters,so why)? Mine are the original flex hoses and look great but surely they don't perform 100% after 20 years(even if the truck has only 48,00miles like mine)?

I found a tech article that offrs some insights to the RWAL issue and would be interested in the reaction of Forum Members to the info there:
http://www.aa1car.com/library/abs_kelseyhayes_rwal.htm

There are lots of other ABS tech articles in this link -you could spend hours there. Enjoy and tell us what you learned in terms of making our trucks brake without drama.

[oldestof11]

I think even BC847 (Admin) said when new, his trucks brakes were not the best.

BTW, all we have is RWAL, one of the 1st forms of ABS for trucks. Deleting one or the other effectively eliminates the other.

[monoblock]

Thanks for the correction/clarification.

[ellis93]

You won't regret cutting it loose,it won't work past 35mph anyhow. Chevy,ford and dodge all shared similar systems and none really did work well.

[oldestof11]

I was told the one thing it tried doing was keeping the truck from swapping ends on slick roads.

[RumbleFish]

Its garbage. My rwal valve just hung itself open out of nowhere, leaving me with a terrible pedal. Get rid of it.

[monoblock]

There is a useful thread with part numbers and dimensions that may help lurkers who are following this discussion:
viewtopic.php?t=6199&highlight=
and it is less than $10!
Why doesn't Geno's sell this as a kit ? They are just generic brake line fittings(Weatherhead?)

I include the link because ineffective brakes could be lethal to you and the poor souls you hit.Avoidable for a $10 mod.
My brakes seem fine but these delete parts,a fluid flush,new flex hoses and front pads should be a prudent improvement.

[CumminsPower59]

This is a post from Philip on another forum, but it is relevant here...

"Don't think of these trucks as having ABS. Think of them having a provision to completely drop all use of the rear brakes. That ABS valve is just a dump valve. When it sees 0 RPM on the rear axle when it was moving seconds before. It determines that rear tires are sliding. It opens a dump valve. This removes all the rear brakes till you let off and reapply the pedal.

Now if you get into a worst case problem. If you need everything that truck has for brakes. Do you want to loose 1/3 of the total braking capacity of the vehicle???

Myself I want to see 4 skids mark behind me if the need comes up."

[RumbleFish]

Couldn't agree more. After mine stuck open, I had a couple severe pucker moments. I should've deleted it sooner!

[ellis93]

Couldn't agree more. After mine stuck open, I had a couple severe pucker moments. I should've deleted it sooner!

Its not a good deal when the cheeks start eating seat

[RumbleFish]

...aaand here come the trainwreck!!!

[PToombs]

[monoblock]

The most condemning comment was that these brakes 'were not great when new'.
The article I cited above discloses there were thousands of complaints/accidents recorded against this system in GM,Ford and Dodge trucks.
In fairness, the article also states the main problems are:
1. water in the brake fluid due to lack of maintenance
2. dirt in the fluid preventing the valves operating
3. false codes/lack of codes/lack of diagnostics for malfunctions.
This is moot if delete=great brakes and stock= unreliable brakes.
The choice seems to be a no brainer for $10 in NAPA parts.
Thanks to all for the advice.

[bmoeller]

ABS is one attempt of the MFG to try and idiot-proof a vehicle. They also tried it on the air brakes in the 70's on the big trucks. Those didn't work either! Now we have 4 wheel ABS, traction control, "ESP", and other management systems. If it is all really NEEDED, the idiot behind the wheel SHOULDN'T be! Just makes the idiots feel braver, and drive faster than the conditions would really allow. (Like the idiots driving in 4HI, and drive faster on the ice and later go flying off of the road............)


One thing to remember, change the brake fluid annually, or every other year. Amazing how well the brakes work after the crap is out of the system.

[monoblock]

I hear you.
Note 1. & 2. above.
Even with the perfect maintenance it seems the RWAL system is too unpredictable to justify keeping it. I have done every possible maintenance task on my brakes & they work perfectly but experience on this Forum indicates they may eventually fail without warning.Perhaps a little piece of rubber from the worn lip of a seal will lodge in a valve of the RWAL and there would be no warning of the failure associated with this.At least that is my take on what others have described and reading the tech article cited above.