Charging voltage

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Re: Charging voltage

Postby Tacoclaw » Mon Jan 03, 2011 8:27 pm

Sorry I never updated this, just got preoccupied with other stuff and it completely slipped my mind.

I put the new battery in first. I couldn't see any sort of date stamp on it, but we get batteries from the Interstate truck delivered at work, so I at least know it hasn't sat on our shelf for very long. With just the battery installed, the truck once again fired up like normal, but it did still have the volt needle twitch and overcorrecting that happened when bottoming/topping out the windows.

I put the new ridiculously expensive Carquest VR on, which looked exactly like the cheap-ass one I got from Autozone(right down to the serial # stamped in the same place in the same font), and the needle sweep has almost stopped completely. It's still there, but it's so slight I figure it's good.

However, the whole reason I started this, the pyro, still hasn't been fixed. I'm going to have to talk to Westach I and see what their opinion of it is. I am using the same EGT probe and wires that I had wired into my previous pyro gauge, but it was wiped out when the Alternator went what?. :sad:

:EDIT: I've been sniffing around and found These. I'm going to get one to throw inline of my factory radio and aftermarket gauges.
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Re: Charging voltage

Postby Tacoclaw » Mon Mar 14, 2011 5:32 pm

Alright, bringing it back. Again. :lol:

First thing I did, was E-mail Westach, and see what they thought of my gauge predicament. My gauge was still in warranty, and after explaining the tests I preformed on it, which were gotten off their website, they asked me to send it in for repairs. After receiving it back a while later, I plugged it in exactly as the directions instructed. Turned the truck on, looked down, and saw the exact behavior as before. :cry:

Another couple of E-mails, mostly me asking if my truck could possibly be doing this (not likely, as I pulled another, working Westach pyro off that very circuit), had it mailed off again. That's where I currently stand now, pyro-wise. Westach definitely stands behind their warranty.

However, I've been working on the Dodge lately, since it's been parked due to fuel prices, and have gotten around to trying a few things with my alternator.

I relocated the voltage regulator over to the front fender, hoping to get it away from the manifold heat:

Image

I also rewired it with heavier-gauge wire throughout it's circuit, along with a dedicated ground to the battery.
(Don't mind the pipe fittings in the washer fluid tank, that's the test tank for my air-to-water for the time being. :lol: )

I also upgraded the actual charge wire to the alternator and am ditching the fusible link for an actual Buss fuse setup:

Image

My big ground from alternator to block was left off, so I'll try again tomorrow, but see below for giant whine-fest.

Now down to the dirt of this long-ass post.

My charging voltage is still in the extremely high 14s. When I first started it, it was charging at 15V even. After a minute of idling, it was down to 14.8, but that's still higher than it's previous best(worst?) of 14.7. I realize they were set to charge this high, but I don't like the though of my truck charging that high. Short of wiring up another regulator, is there anything I can do to drop this voltage down?

Also, my needle has started jumping again. I was hoping that having it's own "perfect" ground would let the regulator prevent this, but the lights are actually pulsing worse after all of this.

Any thoughts?
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Re: Charging voltage

Postby TRENDZ » Fri Mar 18, 2011 4:21 pm

Here's what Ive found. My truck was doing the volt gauge "wiggle wiggle" thing. All the lights would flicker, etc...I finally went out and did some real diagnosis to figure out why, since my previous truck did the same thing. After several tests of wiring, and consulting the factory service manual, I found a voltage drop of 0.8 volts to the blue wiring to the regulator. Tracing the wiring in the manual, I decided to check the fuses that are common with this circuit. Fuse 11, 12, and 13 all had the same drop, their source is one of the "key on" circuits in the ignition switch. I suspect the switch is the culprit, but I haven't checked that far yet. I have however used a jumper wire from the battery to the regulator, to try the charging system. It functions perfectly with the jumper wire attached, and pulses with it removed.
There is still the possibility that the source that FEEDS the ignition switch is weak. The feed originates from the heavy cable from the alternator/battery connection, thru a fuse link, thru the bulkhead connector, than to the ignition switch.
I will post my final findings when I confirm the repair. Hope this info helps.
Last edited by TRENDZ on Sun Mar 20, 2011 7:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
91 d350 1/2" supply lines, 2nd gen lift pump, regulator, 366, screwed, homebrewed afc pin, linkage mods, ported head, ported ex manifold, 351ve electrically controlled, 3" boost tubes, 2nd gen I/C, 4" ex, goerand
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Re: Charging voltage

Postby Tacoclaw » Fri Mar 18, 2011 4:51 pm

It helps greatly, thank you for the specific fuse numbers. :grin:

My windows are far from weak, they're easily the fastest windows I've ever seen in a vehicle, and I'm pretty sure they'd sever a limb if one got caught in there. Before I could easily get an 1/8 of the length of the gauge swing from the needle when they'd top out before I let off the switch. It's less now, after the rewiring and relocation, but still definitely there.

I've suspected my ignition switch of failing multiple times, but it's always been something else on my truck. It may just be time to try to figure out how to get it off of there. I'll try the jumper wire from the battery tomorrow, and thanks again for the idea!

I'm working out of a Chilton's manual (I know!), but it's the best non-manufacturer provided manual I've ever seen. My old man got it back in 1991. Too bad they're not still like this. :cry:
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Re: Charging voltage

Postby TRENDZ » Sun Mar 20, 2011 7:21 am

My original reply has been edited. I gave you the wrong fuse placement numbers. It is corrected in the reply now. My memory... She aint what she used to be.
91 d350 1/2" supply lines, 2nd gen lift pump, regulator, 366, screwed, homebrewed afc pin, linkage mods, ported head, ported ex manifold, 351ve electrically controlled, 3" boost tubes, 2nd gen I/C, 4" ex, goerand
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Re: Charging voltage

Postby Tacoclaw » Wed Mar 30, 2011 7:07 pm

Trendz, I just read your reply to the overcharging thread over on DTR. (Totally weird that that guy has done all the exact same stuff as me, I thought it was someone screwing around at first).

I still haven't even tested mine out with a scrap of wire, but I'll do that and start looking for a diode-equipped relay.

Thanks for keeping that rolling and putting in the time. :grin:

To save you the trouble:

TRENDZ wrote:can't tell you what's wrong, but I can tell you how to fix it.
What happens is, somewhere in the wiring to the voltage regulator there is resistance. This causes the regulator to "see" lower voltage than the rest of the system, causing the regulator to turn the field windings "on" when it really doesn't need to. The extra voltage overcomes the resistance and suddenly the regulator "sees" way to high of a voltage reading. This causes the pulsing you're seeing.
The way I overcame this, was to add a wire from the battery, to a relay, feeding the blue sense wire on the regulator. After doing this, the voltage gauge is rock-steady and I get a dvm reading of steady 14.4 volts.
I did have a problem when I did this at first. I used a hella relay without an internal suppression diode. Relays that don't have a suppression diode release a 300 to 500 volt short duration spike from the coil at very low amperage when turned off. This fried my regulator after the third time I shut the truck off. I put a relay in it with a suppression diode and it has been fine ever since.
Now, the best way would be to find the actual source of the voltage drop, but this is very simple way of overcoming the problem.
1990 W250 4x4
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Re: Charging voltage

Postby Tacoclaw » Sun Oct 23, 2011 5:29 pm

Finally got around to putting a relay on my key-on stuff, I'll grab a pic of it tomorrow.

All I did was go to the big wad of blue wires that are crimped together above my wiper motor, cut the on coming from the keyswitch out and run it into the coil on the relay. I then ran a dedicated hot from the positive post to the big post, and out the other side of the relay I crimped it back into the wad.

Volt-gauge is now smooth as silk, with a barely-noticeable wiggle at idle that goes away with even a light touch on the pedal.

Finally. 8)
1990 W250 4x4
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Re: Charging voltage

Postby TRENDZ » Tue Oct 25, 2011 5:42 pm

Glad to hear it worked. Mines still working great also.
91 d350 1/2" supply lines, 2nd gen lift pump, regulator, 366, screwed, homebrewed afc pin, linkage mods, ported head, ported ex manifold, 351ve electrically controlled, 3" boost tubes, 2nd gen I/C, 4" ex, goerand
TRENDZ
fuel screw!!!!
 
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