Just a little more . . . . .

How to make it go fast

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Re: Just a little more . . . . .

Postby BC847 » Sun Nov 03, 2019 6:22 pm

Yeah. One of the voice's OCD caught a discrepancy in that spelling tonight. The ATSG manual spells it "Bellville". The Goerend Trans folks spell it "Belleville". I'm not sure where I got Bellvue from.

So, I did a Google search:
According to Wikipedia, everybody's right:
A Belleville washer, also known as a coned-disc spring, conical spring washer, disc spring, Belleville spring or cupped spring washer, is a conical shell which can be loaded along its axis either statically or dynamically. A Belleville washer is a type of spring shaped like a washer.

(I'm gonna fix that).
David

1993 12mm VE Fueled W250 CC, Green
12.67 @ 103.35
Your basic farm truck ;)
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Re: Just a little more . . . . .

Postby BC847 » Sun Nov 03, 2019 7:54 pm

Anyhoo, messing with it a little this evening got the Rear (Forward) Clutch, including the input-shaft assembled.

So, start with a clean 48RE billet/alloy input shaft.

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Now, we want to install the rear clutch's apply-piston. I'm upgrading to one that's a little more ridged via more meat and reinforcing ribs. Further, where my OEM apply-piston is of the earlier design, it's 0.840" tall. This new apply-piston is of the late design in that it's 0.780" tall.

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After lubricating all appropriate surfaces, install the apply-piston with a twisting motion so as to lessen the chance of the seal's lip from inverting.

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Next, we'll install the belleville-spring and it's associated hardware.

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Here again, I'm upgrading the belleville-spring by going back to the earlier design. My OEM late design belleville-spring is notably thinner than the earlier design. It's my understanding that the thicker, earlier design hold up better to applications running higher operating pressures.

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The hardware that holds the belleville-spring in place amounts to a steel spacer (my OEM spacer is plastic) and a thin wavy retaining ring. The wavy retaining ring allows some cushioning in addition to holding stuff in place.

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To start the clutch-pack install, we start with the clutch pressure-plate. Notice it's of a seemingly stepped design. That step is in the shape of a V. Wide at the base and thinner at the peak.

Here's the thing, think of the belleville-spring as a teeter-board on a common seesaw. That step in the clutch pressure-plate can be viewed as the pivot-point of the seesaw.

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If we move that seesaw's pivot-point a little more toward the outer diameter of the clutch retainer, we've created a very basic lever.
The apply-piston presses on the long end of the seesaw's teeter-board. The short end of the teeter-board rests in a groove, locked in place. As such the piston's movement is multiplied and translated to the clutch-pack's pressure-plate.

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We can finally start on the actual rear clutch disc / steel disc stack itself. After soaking the clutch discs in trans fluid, we start with a clutch disc up against the pressure-plate. Then we alternate with a steel disc. Back and forth till we've got four clutch discs stacked in front of the pressure-plate.

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Now, install the reaction-plate and lock it all in with a flat retainer ring.
To complete the clutch assembly, we need to dial in the clearance in the clutch stack. Such can be done a number of ways to accomplish the goal even though a given application may use a different count of clutch discs and steels. There are different clutch disc and steel disc thicknesses to select from. There are varying thickness reaction-plates available. I even have a modified pressure-plate that's 0.050" shorter than my OEM one.

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To use the clutch discs that came with my build-kit, I had to move/swap some of the components around. To start with, I prefer to run the thickest pressure and reaction plates possible so as to reduce the chance of the plates flexing and allowing inconsistent apply pressure on the clutch/steels.
The clutch retainer can be had in a number of styles that basically set it up for a specific count of clutch discs. Naturally, my OEM 46RH clutch retainer can't, by design, hold the clutch/steel count I'm after.
I've got a decent selection of different thickness reaction-plates as well as a pretty good selection of retaining rings to work with, so . . .

I selected/moved stuff till I got the rear (forward) clutch-pack set with a clearance of 0.025". (The 48RE spec is 0.025 ~ 0.045". This particular application of the thicker belleville-spring is looking for 0.020 ~ 0.036"). Getting too tight can result in the forward clutch dragging when released, while in reverse gear. As the forward clutch is engaged when going forward, it gets little wear compared to the other clutches of the transmission.

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That's it for tonight. Monday will be on us shortly, if we're lucky. ;)
David

1993 12mm VE Fueled W250 CC, Green
12.67 @ 103.35
Your basic farm truck ;)
BC847
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Re: Just a little more . . . . .

Postby BC847 » Mon Nov 04, 2019 9:17 pm

Good evening bitches!

Got a little more done tonight.

Remember earlier, I'd flat forgotten about the rear-band change, never mind I new nothing of the servo size change.

Well, once again the good folks at Suncoast saved my hiney. I needed a rear band servo BUT! I also need all the other components to complete the install in a 47RH case.

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Wet everything with trans fluid and slip that boy in there.

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Installing the rear-band servo lever completes that section.

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Then, I moved on to the front (direct) clutch.
To start with, I got an upgraded front clutch apply-piston. Instead of a thinner casting, this one started life as a aluminum billet that was milled such that the finished product is notably more ridged so as to lessen any possible flexing during use with higher hydraulic pressures. The design also eliminates a lot of hollow space in the piston so there's less fluid in the thing that, at high rpm, can present with enough pressure to move the piston when you don't want it to move.

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OK, with new seals installed, slather that expected and install the piston in the front clutch housing with a twisting motion (albeit greatly limited) so as to help ensure the seal's lips don't invert.

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Now place the included springs in the milled-in pockets of the apply-piston.

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OK, without putting an eye out, place the piston return spring retainer over the springs. Then safely compress the thing enough to slip the piston spring retainer snap ring in place.

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Here again, to install the clutch/steel stack, start with a steel disc against the apply-piston. Follow that with a clutch disc, and so on. In this case, I got six clutch discs in ending with the front clutch backing plate. As with the forward clutch, one can swap around different thickness clutch discs and steels as well as the backing-plate and front backing-plate snap-ring.
The clearance for this mess is 0.090".

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That's it for tonight. Got ice machine training in the morning.
David

1993 12mm VE Fueled W250 CC, Green
12.67 @ 103.35
Your basic farm truck ;)
BC847
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Re: Just a little more . . . . .

Postby BC847 » Tue Nov 05, 2019 8:15 pm

After consulting a professional trans shop, I spent this evening fine-tuning the clutch pack clearances as well as addressing a looser-fitting than design shell sun-gear. :|
David

1993 12mm VE Fueled W250 CC, Green
12.67 @ 103.35
Your basic farm truck ;)
BC847
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Re: Just a little more . . . . .

Postby BC847 » Thu Nov 07, 2019 8:10 pm

Took Wednesday night off.
Thursday night saw me pressure-wash the drive-shafts, the trans support cross-member and mounting adapter. The skid-plate and transfer-case shifter. Then under the truck including the exposed ass of the engine.
David

1993 12mm VE Fueled W250 CC, Green
12.67 @ 103.35
Your basic farm truck ;)
BC847
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Re: Just a little more . . . . .

Postby BC847 » Sat Nov 09, 2019 5:13 pm

Back when I swapped to a bunch of 48RE rotating parts, I got the 48RE 3-speed section's sun-gear. I kept the associated 46RH drive-shell.

It never occurred to me that since that 48 drive-shell got a little thicker than that of the 46, that there'd be an associated alteration of the related sun-gear to accommodate such. DERP!

That was pointed out to me recently and checking things found my current setup loose. :roll:

Anyhoo, I got that thicker drive-shell today and rebuilt the planetary gear-train so it'd be in the end-play range of 0.006" ~ 0.048" (0.022").
Slipped a temporary 0.060" selectable thrust-washer in the input-shaft's socket and stacked all the mess in the 3-speed case.

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It's starting to get crowded in there.

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From there, I moved on to the pump body/stator assembly.
My original 46RH to the left and, the "reconditioned" 48RE to the right.

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The pump from the 46:

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And that from a 48RE:

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Hmmmmm. See the difference? I wonder which is more desirable and why.
David

1993 12mm VE Fueled W250 CC, Green
12.67 @ 103.35
Your basic farm truck ;)
BC847
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Re: Just a little more . . . . .

Postby BC847 » Mon Nov 11, 2019 6:35 pm

Got the driveshafts disassembled and ready to go to the shop.
David

1993 12mm VE Fueled W250 CC, Green
12.67 @ 103.35
Your basic farm truck ;)
BC847
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Re: Just a little more . . . . .

Postby BC847 » Mon Nov 11, 2019 7:10 pm

Converting your mess to lock-up moves the transmission back 1 1/8" (1.125")

NO more, no less.

Image
David

1993 12mm VE Fueled W250 CC, Green
12.67 @ 103.35
Your basic farm truck ;)
BC847
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Re: Just a little more . . . . .

Postby BC847 » Wed Nov 13, 2019 7:02 pm

Delivered the driveshafts to the shop.
The front shaft's telescoping joint was worn weird so, gotta replace that. Otherwise, rebuild the OEM CV joint, new universal joint on the axle-end. Lengthen it 1.125" and balance.
The rear shaft will be shortened by 1.125", new carrier-bearing, universal-joints and balance.

Geeez! Kinda hurt my feelings.

It turns out the trans fluid pump from the 48RE is, in addition to the larger lobes, is larger in overall diameter. The guy telling it said it might be around a 10% increase in volume.

OK.

I got the so called rebuilt. . . . whatever 48RE stator support from the same place I got the 47RH valve-body from. One of the pump-body's hydraulic fluid passages has crap in it that I can scrape loose with a pick. I've got it soaking in some stiff metal-safe cleaner. I'll get the pressure-washer after it tomorrow.

With that I got moving to the next stage of setting the overall end-play.

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There's a couple of places to work with.

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Keep moving forward . . . . .
David

1993 12mm VE Fueled W250 CC, Green
12.67 @ 103.35
Your basic farm truck ;)
BC847
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Re: Just a little more . . . . .

Postby BC847 » Fri Nov 15, 2019 10:42 pm

Alright. Got the pump body fluid passages clean. I then installed the mo'betta Gerotors in the oil-pump body.

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Then installed the oil-pump cover/stator shaft assembly. Torqued the bolts to 180in/lbs.

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Now temporarily install the thing in the 3-speed case with it's gasket and selective spacers to get started. Torque it down.

Set up your micrometer to see the total end-play at the end of the input-shaft

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Put your big flat-blade screwdriver between the rear drum and the drive shell. You'll be lifting the gear and clutch sections.

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Now, make a baseline reading and take it all back apart removing the clutch-packs, swapping around those two selections of thrust-washers, put it all back together, and check the end-play again . . . . about eleventeen times till you, in this case, come up with a total end-play of 0.048" (out of a range of 0.034" ~ 0.084"). I figure things will loosen up with some runtime.

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Tomorrow, I'll take it all apart again to install all the seals. :grin:
David

1993 12mm VE Fueled W250 CC, Green
12.67 @ 103.35
Your basic farm truck ;)
BC847
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Re: Just a little more . . . . .

Postby BC847 » Sat Nov 16, 2019 6:06 pm

Today I installed the:
- 2 Front clutch sealing rings.
- 1 Stator shaft sealing ring.
- 1 Clutch hub sealing ring.
- 2 Turbine shaft sealing rings.
- Front band.
- Pump housing gasket and seal.
- Pump housing bolt seals.
Slid it all together and torqued it down.

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Installed the 1-2 accumulator piston, the front band adjusting screw, the associated front band anchor strut, and the apply strut.
Tightened both the front and rear bands to 72in/lbs. Then backed the front band off 1 3/4 turns, the rear band three turns. Then torqued down the jamb-nuts.

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Installed the line-pressure sensor as well as plugged the other fluid-pressure reference-ports on the passenger's side.

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Went to the driver's side and installed the AN-8 cooler-line fittings, a new shifter seal and plugged that final fluid pressure reference-port.

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Removed the overdrive section to 3-speed case bolts, applied Blue Lock-Tite and torqued them to 25ft/lbs.

Then harvested those components from the 46RH valve-body needed for use in the 47 valve-body.

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I'm getting down to the short-rows of the transmission build.
David

1993 12mm VE Fueled W250 CC, Green
12.67 @ 103.35
Your basic farm truck ;)
BC847
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Re: Just a little more . . . . .

Postby BC847 » Sun Nov 17, 2019 5:51 pm

I forgot to mod the valve-body for 2nd gear lock-up. :shock:

Crap.

Disassembled the VB enough to remove the lower housing. Using PermaWeld epoxy, blocked one of the worm-tracks associated with the 3-4 shift spool-valve and the converter clutch spool-valve.

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Put it all back together, . . . . again. Then installed the overdrive and converter clutch solenoid-valves.

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Nailed down the solenoid plug and reset the line-pressure adjustment.

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Before I install the valve-body, I want to check the operation of the bands and clutch-packs. I do that with a regulated supply of dry Nitrogen gas.

My regulated supply of dry Nitrogen gas is in my work-truck that's in the shop this weekend to fix the backup radar thing. DOH!
David

1993 12mm VE Fueled W250 CC, Green
12.67 @ 103.35
Your basic farm truck ;)
BC847
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Re: Just a little more . . . . .

Postby BC847 » Mon Nov 18, 2019 8:11 pm

After a late start this evening, I laid the thing on its side. Sumbitch is heavy!!

Got the dry Nitrogen and pressure-tested the clutch-packs and servos. Nice and smooth with no "What Is That?!" hissing.

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After lubing the shifter and electrics-plug ports, I installed the valve-body, park/neutral safety-switch and oil filter.

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BTW. For the record, my 1993 Dodge W250 CC w/3-speed+OD has NO seal at the ass of the overdrive case. Trans fluid runs freely to and from that transmission-to-transfer-case adapter. Those two, back-to-back seals in the transfer-case keep folks separate.

Image


That's it for tonight.
David

1993 12mm VE Fueled W250 CC, Green
12.67 @ 103.35
Your basic farm truck ;)
BC847
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Re: Just a little more . . . . .

Postby PToombs » Tue Nov 19, 2019 3:24 pm

Looking good Dave! I'll be down to pick it up this weekend! :jumpsmile:
Why dry nitrogen instead of air? to keep moisture out?
pete

Just enough power to break everything behind the crankshaft.
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Re: Just a little more . . . . .

Postby BC847 » Tue Nov 19, 2019 3:50 pm

PToombs wrote:Looking good Dave! I'll be down to pick it up this weekend! :jumpsmile:
Why dry nitrogen instead of air? to keep moisture out?


Just a heads-up, the core-charge is a mofo, BIG-time. Seriously!! ;)

Yup, To keep things dry (and I have it available and, . . the danged air-compressor finally blew off to the big tank in the sky. I'm having a hard time justifying $1200 ~ 1500 for a new one).
David

1993 12mm VE Fueled W250 CC, Green
12.67 @ 103.35
Your basic farm truck ;)
BC847
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