6.7 C/R to VE conversion OBSERVATIONS.

[Mark Nixon]

Recently I picked up a 6.7 to investigate, curiousity, ya' know?

The intent is to investigate, then possibly put a VE pump on it, the following is what I have noted so far:

1.Contrary to popular belief and as some have stated, they ARE NOT "just a couple bolt holes and a dowel pin off".
It's more like 7 bolt holes, plus BOTH dowel pins are WAY off.
Then there would be the filling of old holes that are half-off and re-tapping them slightly over from the original holes.
There are more than enough bolt holes in their correct places to hold it stable enough to do measuring and tracing to get the missing/wrong holes corrected and added in.

2.The cam timing pin housing located on the back of the VE case WILL NOT clear without relieving the block of some of the extra casting there. It is "minor surgery" with a grinder to correct this and it affects nothing else.
The simplest solution is to relieve the block to bolt it in, welding up the holes for it would be more work, IMO.

3.With the VE pump set in place on the bolted on case, I found that there is a bolt boss on the block that's not necessary for anything related to VE, BUT it interferes unless the VE is set at full advanced. This block bolt boss could be removed.
The part that hits on the PUMP is one of the 2 un-used mounting bolt holes between the head and the advance rib on the pump. This could theroetically be removed, as well.

4.Geartrain gears. Commonrails use straight cut gears. VE, P-7100 and VPs all use helix, or diagonal cut gears, so the crank gear needs swapped, as well as the oil pump and cam gear.

5. Oil pan rail. The bolt pattern is totally different at the front because of the timing case depth.
So far it looks like the pan's whole bolt pattern is also slightly different, but I have yet to trial fit an older pan on it.

6.Crankcase venting. The commonrail blocks do not have a tappet cover, rather they have cup plugs in the side of the block, in front of each lifter, to allow the lifters to be held up. This in itself is no problem, but the crankcase vent hides right where the traditional vacuum/power steering set-up is located. The vent resembles a fuel pump block off plate with a hose barb affixed to it.
My preliminary idea on this is to fully block it off and vent from a place on the valve cover.
The revised vent block-off would incorporate a system for mounting the rear of the injection pump and the power steering/vacuum pump rear support.

All in all, as it stands, it appears the VE conversion (or P-pump, for that matter) could be done with a fairly minimal amount of specialized machine work and it's likely it's not beyond a person with a good grasp of how to drill and tap straight holes.
The most critical thing is getting the case properly aligned to allow proper cam-to-pump gear meshing, then placing the dowel pins properly.
That can be done by finding the proper mesh depth on an already assembled VE engine, along with straightedges at the panrail-to-timing case area.

Mark.

[bgilbert]

You should try it and report back to us.

[The_Head]

Is it possible to swap out the rotating assembly?

[Remps]

The long stroke 6.7 with its 24 valve head combined with the low end fueling of the ve would make a torque monster.

[Mark Nixon]

Is it possible to swap out the rotating assembly?

I can't 100% answer that, because I don't know if the main bearing diameter is the same for 6.7 and 5.9.
I know that the rods are the same length and that the rod journals are the same diameter.
The backside of the crank is the same bolt pattern.

I had given thought to sleeving a 5.9 to 6.7 bore size, but that's as much as procuring a usable 6.7 shortblock, trust me, I checked.

Mark.

[ellis93]

Feb.2010 issue of diesel power mag had a truck called lethal injection that had 6.7 / 5.9 combo in it.

[The_Head]

hmm, I wonder what you get if you just use the 6.7 stroke and the 5.9 bore.

[Mark Nixon]

'Head,
Here are the specs;

5.9 bore/stroke:
4.02/4.72

6.7 bore/stroke:
4.21/4.88

A 5.9 block with a 6.7 crank comes out to 372 cubes or 6.1 liters.

Since it's a 6 cylinder, to deal with the extra .160" in piston height, you could stack gaskets or shave the piston tops, or even a combo of the 2.
Hell, some marine applications and industrial applications run the ring very close to the top of the piston, anyway, so all you'd end up doing is simulating that when you shave them.
Compression ratio would be high, though.

Mark.

[cougar]

I seem to remember one of the things they did trying to appease the EPA was move the ring grooves around from year to year. Maybe there is a better suited year for pistons to "mill" in this case.

[Begle1]

I can't see how putting a VE on a 6.7 would ever be worth the effort.

[Mark Nixon]

I can't see how putting a VE on a 6.7 would ever be worth the effort.

THAT kind of comment is why it's WORTH the effort.
Electronics are your enemy, DO NOT CONFORM, delete, delete, DELETE!

Mark.

[dazedandconfused]

We have a 7.3 PSD, LLY Duramax and my two first gens and I would give up the other two for my VE Motors. I love these old engines. Nothing like the simplicity of the old engines.

[Erska]

Diesel engine should never need electricity to run! Even the electric shut down solenoid is too much! Cable is the only way!

[matchew]

I got my new to me ve motor from a guy at Peachtree Auto ( I think) in Bend, Oregon (I think). He was telling me it's not very difficult to P-pump the 6.7. The pulling guys are doing it for the same reason you want too, NO ELECTRONICS!

[Mark Nixon]

I got my new to me ve motor from a guy at Peachtree Auto ( I think) in Bend, Oregon (I think). He was telling me it's not very difficult to P-pump the 6.7. The pulling guys are doing it for the same reason you want too, NO ELECTRONICS!

Thing is, "The Pulling Guys" WILL NOT share usable information, especially if it's new, gains them an unseen upper hand and would be popular.
So, even though this may be a "new" swap to me, or the majority of the rest of us, one of the puller guys will probably pop their head in and be a wiseass, saying how things will and will not work.
I will find out for myself, through my OWN EXPERIENCE , what the truth is.
I generally don't depend on them for usable information.

The P-7100 timing case bolts on the EXACT same way as a VE case, there literally is NO difference in number of bolts, or the bolt pattern.
As far as difficulty to do it, that depends on the tools at your disposal.
The average guy "can" do the case bolts, fill and re-work the holes that are not quite in line, drill and tap them, if he's patient and has common sense.
There's always the machine shop for those who have doubts on their own abilities.

Mark.