bosch 190 opinions

[gomerpile]

alright right now i am decididing on my injectors, and i have a few questions on the 190's

1st- do you get metter mpg
2nd- how much power do you get
3rd- how bad are egts
4th- are they clean or can they be dirty"if i like"
5th- they assist to the path of 300 hp with fuel pin and pump mods/ turbo upgrade
6th- any likes or dislikes of them
7th- are they reliable

last question for now, if i buy these will it be worth it or just throwing out my money?

[CumminsPride]

Murdawg is running them. From what I've read the hp is around 30rwhp gains. I dunno if that was official though. For a hundred bucks more you could have a set of edm'd 370's from new era! This would put down closer to the 300 mark than the 190's and you'd have less pump mods to get you there. Also there is talk about them in the 330 thread about light driving or how dirty they can get. Hope this helps it's just my $.02 !

Wade

[BC847]

I run the PDR 190's.

They are a conservative injector for sure.

A little history . . . . .

I don't claim to know exactly how it goes but . . . . There was/is the "185" injectors. They apparently were an OEM item and performed very well as such. PDR (perhaps others) developed an alternative to them that were proven to produce more power, thus the 190s. Check their website to see a substantial price difference.


The 190s are a good mild injector for those looking a little more over stock. In my application, with the typical VE mods, I'm able to produce right at 244 hp / 611ft/lbs.

The blue graph is on #2, the red is with W/M.


They "Fit" a hybrid HX35 nicely such that with the IP fuel screw run in to the max, a WOT pass has them produce a light brown smoke at the tailpipe. With that, the EGT's approach 1400*F after 30sec. Adjusting the star-wheel correctly enables one to run with very little smoke. As with any injector, bottoming the star-wheel will make big smoke if that's what you're in to.



While I have no first-hand experience with the 370s, it's my understanding they were originally designed to work with the 370hp marine Cummins 5.9. They apparently run a different piston top profile and as such, are rather smoky in our application. The EDM'ed version may be cleaner, I dunno. Still though, they flow more fuel than stock, or the 190s for that matter and should produce more power albeit dirty.

Hope this helps.

[DTanklage]

.....with that, the EGT's approach 1400*F after 30sec. Adjusting the star-wheel correctly enables one to run with very little smoke...

how much boost are you running that you see egt's like that with those small injectors?

[RumbleFish]

I run the PDR 190's.

They are a conservative injector for sure.

A little history . . . . .

I don't claim to know exactly how it goes but . . . . There was/is the "185" injectors. They apparently were an OEM item and performed very well as such. PDR (perhaps others) developed an alternative to them that were proven to produce more power, thus the 190s. Check their website to see a substantial price difference.

The version I heard was that the price of the 185's skyrocketed, so "they" (PDR I think) devised these as an alternative for a LOT less money.

[BC847]

.....with that, the EGT's approach 1400*F after 30sec. Adjusting the star-wheel correctly enables one to run with very little smoke...

how much boost are you running that you see egt's like that with those small injectors?

38 pounds boost. The injection pump is set at 2.00mm timing.

I run the PDR 190's.

They are a conservative injector for sure.

A little history . . . . .

I don't claim to know exactly how it goes but . . . . There was/is the "185" injectors. They apparently were an OEM item and performed very well as such. PDR (perhaps others) developed an alternative to them that were proven to produce more power, thus the 190s. Check their website to see a substantial price difference.

The version I heard was that the price of the 185's skyrocketed, so "they" (PDR I think) devised these as an alternative for a LOT less money.

Yup.

[dpuckett]

Hey, Don, I can get to 1250 with my stockers, so with 30more HP, I could see 1400 EGT.

I think 2.0mm is a little steep, but if it works for you, I can live with it. I'd think it'd kill your botom end, though. Mine is at 1.4 now; still expereimenting for better MPG. I think lowering the pop pressure to closer to stock would help.

Bosch discovered the popularity of the 185 tips, and tripled the price and then some. PDR did some R&D and came up with a good alternative. There are lots of imitators, but beware the number of holes and the spray pattern.

Daniel

[BC847]

Oddly, my truck came stock with 1.4mm timing.

[gomerpile]

alright thanks for the responces, but can these flow enough fuel to lay a cloud, i mean tailgater-b-gone spray, if i was into those kinds of things.

and i know the 370's will flow more fuel but im worried about milage on them

[ofcmarc]

alright thanks for the responces, but can these flow enough fuel to lay a cloud, i mean tailgater-b-gone spray, if i was into those kinds of things.

and i know the 370's will flow more fuel but im worried about milage on them

I have 190s and they will lay out a decent cloud before the turbo spools. Once the turbo spools, I clear up to a haze if I keep my foot in it.

[Murdawg]

Ya I got 190's also. They are not bad. I wish I had gone bigger. When have you ever said i wish i had gotten a little less power or a little less smoke. I have the tip ground of my afc the star wheel turned down some and my pin ground good and I can cover the road with smoke. The more you lug it down the more smoke rolls. One boost kicks in as he said it clears up.
My opinion get the biggest one's you can afford. Smoke out everyone from here to kindom come.
And yes with some pump work you can put out enough smoke to make people drop off real quick.

[MMiller]

I've got one of the last sets of cheep 185's and I'm happy with them. With a ground fuel pin, and low set star wheel I can smoke tailgaters at will, once the boost gauge falls to zero. With a stock charger, I run about 30 psi of boost, and last dyno indicated 235hp/586tq, but that was will a stock fuel pin. Its enough fuel to get into trouble towing heavy, as I'm experiancing turbo surge and higher then I like EGT's. I still get 19-20 mpg empty fuel economy with 4X4 and big mud tires. It was a real good shot in the pants power increase.

I need more air flow long before I need anymore fuel. I need a larger intercooler, and some sort of turbo mods, I'm thinking small twins........

Long story short, I'm happy with the 185's and wouldn't hesitate to buy a set of 190s for a towing truck. If its a hot rod, then by all means go bigger.

Michael

[DTanklage]

okay - i am lost...

the tips were originally designed for p-pump trucks which push a lot more fuel and push it at a higher pressure

still trying to find out the exact dimensions but i believe both those tips (2nd gen 185 & 190) are smaller than the stock first gen 6x009

if they are smaller how can they flow more fuel????

don

[MMiller]

The bosch 185/190s are for v/e pumped engines. Supposidly out of maybe 185 hp application, instead of the 160 horse application that our truck engines are. When bosch found out we were using them for a cheep increase in power, they jumped the price up from about $350 for a set to whatever they are now. I was able to get mine on sale from PDR for about $330.

But the long and short, is they are for v/e cummins engines, not P-Pumps. 370's are P-pump marine injectors.

Michael

[DTanklage]

gotcha

okay, then which other tips listed in my chart are actually hp (or supposed hp) numbers for ve motors, not p-pump????

sure is confusing - especially when the extrude hone injectors may flow more for a given size hole than a straight hole (and i am not 100% sold on that idea either)

hope that is how it works - just ordered some ddp stg iv's for my rag