?? on bosch 190's and ?? on extrude honing

[dodgebullit]

Ok I'm pretty new to diesels but I'm trying to figure some of this stuff out. I'm planing to get a little more power for towing in my 93 D350. I'm not to concerned with hp/torque numbers but I don't wanna see to many people waiting in line behind me while getting on the on ramp. So far I advanced the timing 1/8 in ground a little on deep part of the fuel pin smoke screw all the way up starwheel almost all the way up the fuel screw was turned in when I bought the truck I'm not really sure how far so I've left it there for now. And an intake. I plan to put quages in next 4in turbo back exhaust. Second gen low pressure piston pump cooler tubesz and maybe a second gen intercooler and m and h m2 fuel pin. I'm going to run a wastegated S300 suber b turbo I believe its 57/65/14.
Ok now for my questions. I'm looking into the 5 hole bosh 190's but I can't find any. I've looked at a lot of places but so far I've been only able to find 4 hole . I also was wondering why they atomize better that the sock i/c injectors. They are smaller but make more power. Are they extrude honed?? Can I get the nozzles extrude honed bigger if I decided to go with a compound set up later?? Are there any differences in the 4 holers and 5 holers as far as spray angles and pop pressure?? Thanks for any info or help!! My main concern is just trying to find the 5 hole bosch 190's Oh and a part number for them would be very helpful . Be free to let me know if I should change anything on my set up. Right now the truck is getting ready for paint

[RCCUMMINS89]

Being a 93 I wouldn't go with the Bosch 190 injectors (4 hole or 5 hole)(I can get you either) unless you planned on leaving the truck close to stock.

Close to stock they are decently clean and if tuned proper are a VERY good injector for towing. I've ran them and was very impressed with how they performed.

But wanting to go with more power in the future.........requires opening them up and upping the fuel, which requires more timing and makes the wrong spray angle a major issue.






Like I've recommended a dozen times and for good reason.............if one plans on running a decently matched towing set up yet wants the opportunity to go larger in the future.

5x13 with a super b turbo. When one is ready for twins.............extrude hone the 5x13s and add a low press. turbo and you've got a matched set up that will cool anything the 12mm ve can put out.

[RCCUMMINS89]

And the reason the bosch 190 injectors do so well.

They have a broader spray angle and therefore mix with the air better and thus makes a very responsive burn. Downside of course is they can be hazy due to the improper angle. If one tows, it usually is not noticeable. If you plan on towing livestock or horses...........not recommended.

They also are smaller than stock (the 4 holers) and thus break up the fuel better. They give the illusion of having more power than stock due to the more responsive throttle. When in reality............they don't. My truck made less boost and was slower at wot with the 4 hole bosch 190s than factory injectors. But it did respond very well at low rpms and felt like it had more torque. This is why seat of the pants is a major illusion.



The 5 hole bosch 190s are a 54lpm VCO style injector that is similar to a 5x12 marine 370.........just a vco stick. These make an incredible amount of power...........but are extremely dirty in an I/c truck.

[dodgebullit]

Ok cool thanks for clearing that up! So the bosch 190's from pdr are perfectly ok. If you end up with a little haze could you advance the timing to clear it up?? Another question since they are a smaller injector would it be harder on the pump if you turned the fuel screw all they way in? Any other recommendations for injectors for towing with the super b turbo . the truck and trailer are plated for 11,000lbs a piece so I wouldn't go over a total of 22,000 lbs towing

[Sutter1stgen]

With the 190s or plus 40hp injectors I had imwas able to put down 255/555. I probably had a wee bit more left in it on pump adjustments, but not much. Your fss will get chewed up like redman tobacco at a a shotgun wedding. I went through 3 in about 1.5 years. I would highly reconmend buying once, and crying one. I'd going with a 5x12 or larger like RC suggested. I added pretty much the same setup to my old boss's 93'. With the pump close to maxed it has way too much fuel. But dialed down around a 1300 degree egt limit, boy does it run. With a primary charger beneath the superB that truck would really move with low egts.

RC had a hand in the parts selection of that trucks build. There was some thought into where the truck would end up, setting it up to reuse parts later on.

[dodgebullit]

Sorry RC I didn't see your first post... I was in a hurry getting ready for work. I just checked out your website... Dang you got a lot of fun stuff for the first gen's and that's a sexy little ramcharger you got there... Well maybe not so little. I got a cherry 86 2 tone red and white ramcharger I picked up from california I would like to turn into a cummins someday when my pockets get a little deeper. I'm definitely interested in a set of those flow honed injectors... Are the flowed injectors smokier than the normal ones? If I go through you for a set of injectors can I get what ever size I want? I'm thinking 5x12 or 13 with the 145 angle . It makes more sense if I'm gonna go bigger later. Thanks for the info sutter I like being able to shut my truck off with the key

[dodgebullit]

So since a flow honed injector will flow quite a bit more fuel in theory I could go with a smaller nozzle holes that would atomize better. But if I had flow honed injectors to start with could I still open them up later?

[RCCUMMINS89]

We can flow hone your injectors at any time............and the price basically stays the same. Therefore, I usually recommend going with a straight edm injector up front and if you need more fuel later on.........we can then hone them. Extrude hone nozzles generally are slightly cleaner.........up until a point. Because of what they do to how the nozzle sprays they will become dirty after a certain amount of opening them up.

If you'd like to talk about the process more in depth, please feel free to call me. It's hunting season and therefore I might not pick up, but will get back to you within a day.

Yes, I can get you whichever and whichever size injector you'd like.

Thanks for the compliments on the RC.............it does it's job on how I use it. An RC Cummins is a lot of fun to drive.

[dodgebullit]

Ok well thank you very much I appreciate the help. Ill be sure to do that

[Deathrod]

Extrude hone nozzles generally are slightly cleaner.........up until a point

I think mine are a little past that point.....haha

[RCCUMMINS89]

Yours are really big............keep in mind, I originally did those up for myself and a quest for 500rwhp.

[Deathrod]

I bet ya I wouldn't be far off with a manual tranny......

[brandonmgreer]

I need to call you, RC. How retarded is 500hp for a goal with a 12 or 14mm pump? I bounced a ? off you about mileage with the 7x10's but I have 2 92 models, and one is pretty solid mechanically, but looks like a heap - paint faded, someone painted the roof white with a brush, no tailgate, and dents all over... The other is pretty nice, so I think I wanna build it as my little put put around town truck.

I'm thinking farm truck sleeper for the rough one... You game for the challenge? Maybe I'll make a trip to Cali when its done and find Jason!!! I'll even put one of your stickers on it, and I don't do stickers.

Basically a super redneck truck with giant cajones

[DMan1198]

500 on a ve isn't retarded at all with either pump. It is however quite a challenge. I think the injectors rc has might be the best for that goal. I'd do a cam swap and a bit of head work. Then it's just down to turbo selection and tuning

[RCCUMMINS89]

500hp goal for a 12mm isn't retarded.........TOUGH. As it has not been done yet, but there are a few of us trying for it. I'm running into timing and case press. issues. Not to make the power........but to keep my truck driving as it should.

500 with a 14 h/r is not difficult at all..... just more money.