Pump Issues

[cummins king]

to start off this is a difrent pump then im use too, so i need some help tuning it in, my old one was a 205 and the new one is a 114
so i rebiult my pump two nights ago and i did it twice to make sure i didnt Fup, and everything went to gether well, i stick it on the truck and adjust a few things and i get it running, its idleing low, so i will either put the fuel screw in more or i will put a screw in the idle adjuster, thats fixed

the main problem is when i give it fuel, and then let go it, slowly goes down back to idle, its very slow not snapy like it use to be, any ideas

also when i give it gas it heasitates, then goes, its idling at 500rmp so i think that is the problem there

and a side note, a 114 is a bigger about 40% bigger then a 205 pump

[seeker1056]

how do you tell a 205 from a 114

[cummins king]

the numbers on the side of the pump

[seeker1056]

several thoughts

How did you set the base timing on the pump - is it at "0" degrees?
In all of the various literature and posts on the VE pump nowhere have I found any reference to setting the pump for number one, and or base timing.
Anyone got the answers to this?

What did you set the pump timing on the motor?

It may not be pump related but settings or air

I know when i put my POD's in it acted funny like that the first six or seven times i fired it up, and turning in the fuel screw till idle was 850 solved the problem (no idle screw setting - it is all fuel that sets my idle)

[cummins king]

when i put it to geither i put the timing at 0 and when it went on the truck i had to turn the pump saft to fit in the pump gear, in doing that im setting the timing exacly where the old pump was, i dont think its a timming issue, like the truck runs great, but i cant tell the exact timming because i broke my case pressure line, so i will fix it on monday and then i can see where the timming is at, higher case pressure means more timming

i belive that my issure is in the govern wieght screw, i didnt mark where it was supost to be set at, i just set it at the same as my other pump,

anybody know how the putting the govern weight screw in or out affects the acceleration and deseleration of truck

[dpuckett]

If it floats down from revving, you are on the verge of runaway. Back the full fuel screw out a 1/2 turn.

Where and how, exactly, is the 114 pump "40% bigger" than the 205? I thought they were both 12mm VEs, with a few internal differences, but nothing real noteworthy.

I dont know much about the governor screw, other than going in increases the fuel, and out decreases it.

Daniel

[cummins king]

the center hole seems bigger and the fins, on the piston is deeper then the 205

so i backed out the fuel screw 1/2 turn and put the idle screw back in and is not doing it any more when im in park, but when i comming to a stop light it does it, just not as bad

for some reason i think my timming i way off like 2 teeth, because the pump is all the way on the retarded side of the adjustment and it still making a weird noise like a bad rod, oil pressure it really good, and when i step on it i get 30 pounds, and if i hold it, it sounds like its hitting a govener, but the rpms are only 2700 ish, my exaust temp is lower, man that thing should be screamming with the 6x20s and twin but it feels like im not getting enough fuel, maby i have to put the screw in more on the govenr weights, but its driving me nuts not being able to figuar the problem out, maby a word of advise KTA

[seeker1056]

Hey Ck - I have the proper timing tool if you would liek to borrow it - only thing it is in imperial so you would have to do the conversion to metric mm.

[cummins king]

how does the timming tool work,

[seeker1056]

I have all of the instructions i can print directly from the DODGE engine manual
It is inserted thru the hole under the plug that is in the centre of the dv valves.

Basically you roll to top dead, set the dial guage to the spec, then roatate the motor back and forth taking a reading

Then yu set the pump at the one you want

I beleive 1.4 mm is stock and 1.7mm is that infamous 1/8" push we all use

If ya wanted to be ready for Saturday you could drive down here and get it - its only about 2 hours

[KTA]

The timming tool measures plunger lift in mm that corresponds to the lift numbers written on the dataplate on the timing cover. That is how you are supposed to set the timing. I can't particularly advise you as I am lost to what you are talking about most of the time. Like:

What is the"governor screw"?

I am also wondering did you change injectors at the same time as the pump?

[cummins king]

okay what i mean by govener screw is the screw/ shaft that the govener weights spin on, how does that adjust the fuel (out is more fuel in is less fuel)

i put the injectors in with the old pump ran it for a little while ( like 30mins) then i put the new pump on because i needed the c clip to hold the seal

am i right in saying if the #1 cyl, is at tdc, then the key on the ip gear should also be tdc, (for stock settings)

Ken
the new, dyno day isnt untill the sat after this one

[KTA]

That screw is NOT a performance adjustment. It should be tight enough so that the governor gear/ weight assembly does not move in and out on the shaft. There are shims on the front side of the gear weight assembly as well. These are used to adjust the poisitioning of the gear for proper tooth engagment with the drive shaft. If you left this thing loose you will have very erratic governor control, well actually you have pretty much no control because the thing is bouncing and beating around inside the pump.
on other issues if your knocking sound also sounds like a miss you probably have a split injector tip.

[sdstriper]

am i right in saying if the #1 cyl, is at tdc, then the key on the ip gear should also be tdc, (for stock setting)

The key would then be in the 6 o'clock position, give or take a bit. That is if your #1 cylinder was actually at TDC and the I/P Gear was correctly matched to the OEM timing marks (letters).

Have you used the timing pin to find TDC or have you determined TDC by using the valve drop method.

Sounds to me like you need to actually determine TDC, get the timing tool adapter and a dial indicator and bench set that I/P. Then you'll really know what the hell is going on there.

Using the valve drop method, not the timing pin, you should find actual TDC. If the timing pin hits the hole after you have determined TDC with the valve drop method then it (timing pin) can be trusted.

[cummins king]

no it doent souund like a miss it just soulds like a timming noise

besides being noisy what does to much timming do to the motor, like it raises head pressure, right.

so even if i put #1cyl to tdc there is no garrenty that the stocks settings for the ip is 6oclk